Will Madoff’s Investors Break Even?

Madoff offers a ponzi pointer (Photo: Shannon Stapleton/REUTERS)

Bernie Madoff investors might end up getting more of their money back then they thought.

Two years after the now-convicted-and-jailed Ponzi schemer’s arrest, the prospects for his beleaguered victims are all of a sudden looking up. In the past few weeks, Irving Picard, the bankruptcy trustee in the financial fraud case has issued a flurry of lawsuits and settlements. The trustee netted $500 million on Monday alone in a settlement with Swiss bank Union Bancaire Privee. Picard’s moves are raising the possibility that Madoff investors could get all of their money back and then some. In fact, if Picard is successful in all of his cases, investors in the what has been called the largest financial fraud in history could walk away with a 65% profit. That is in large part due to the efforts of Picard and his team of lawyers, and the peculiarities of the fraud. Here’s why:

In the weeks following the arrest, experts said that fraud’s victims were likely to end up losing nearly everything they sunk into Madoff’s funds. An Associated Press article from early January 2009, said Bernie’s victims would be lucky to get back even 10% of their money. Every dollar invested would come back worth pennies. Many victims hocked jewelery and other valuables. Some sold houses. A few committed suicide.

Nearly two years later, though, it looks those who put their money in the worldwide ponzi scheme will turn out far better than many predicted. Picard has recently rolled out a number of large cases against banks, which he believes enabled Madoff and should have suspected fraud. (After two years, it becomes harder to bring some of these suits.) Among the recent cases are suits against British bank HSBC for $9 billion, and JP Morgan Chase for $6.4 billion. The recent cases are on top of the $15.5 billion in legal claims Picard already has filed. The trustee has also recovered nearly $2 billion, including Monday’s settlement. All told, Picard could collect nearly $35 billion for Madoff investors.

That number, surprisingly, is considerably larger than what is now believed to have been invested in Madoff’s phony funds. Picard has approved 15,491 investors’ claims for $5.8 billion. There are another 900 claims from investors or funds of investors who say they or their clients lost money. Stephen Harbeck, who is president of the Securities Investor Protection Corporation,which is officially in charge of pursuing Madoff’s estate for investor losses, says many of those remaining claims include the larger feeder funds and could be billions each. Even so, Picard’s findings point to the total investment losses in the Madoff fraud, when you net out the fictitious gains,  to be just under $20 billion.

Kevin McCue, who is on Picard’s team at law firm Baker Hostetler, says whatever the trustee is able to recover will be distributed to investors based on the size of their claims. Once investors are paid back their investment in full, the trustee will settle the $1.7 billion that the Madoff’f securities firm, which went bankrupt when the fraud was discovered, owes to other non-investor creditors, including paying back SIPC for the nearly $250 million in fees that it has shelled out to retain Picard’s firm and other professionals trying to recover money for investors.  But even after those claims are paid there could be an additional $13 billion left in Picard’s purse. It is likely that money would be distributed to Madoff investors as profit.

Madoff, it appears, never turned a profit on the money he was given or even invested it. So how is it possible that his “investors” could end up with a gain? The reason is that Picard is suing the banks for above and beyond what they got in fees for working with Madoff. Picard says the banks should have to pay damages for their support of Bernie. It appears the best asset Madoff investors ever had was the fraud itself. At the end of the day, the Madoff’s graft was surprisingly basic. He made up fake statements and shifted money among investors. Picard says it was simple enough and went on for so long that many of the banks should have known. Indeed, Picard claims HSBC’s own auditors told management that Madoff’s purported investment gains were suspicious. Another bonus is that Madoff was a relatively frugal ponzier. Unlike others fraudsters he didn’t blow the majority of this funds. He distributed it to other investors.

Harbeck stresses that there is a lot that would have to go right for investors to get all of their money back. He says full recovery is still an unlikely outcome. And he says that it is silly to even think that Picard might turn up enough money for investors to turn a profit.  “There is a big difference between filing a suit, winning a suit and being able to collect on that suit,” says Harbeck. The banks don’t want to be found responsible for any part of the Madoff fraud. So they are unlikely to settle, especially if that means paying out large funds that make them look like they are admitting guilt. That could open them up to other legal claims. Indeed, both HSBC and JP Morgan say they did nothing wrong and that they will fight Picard’s suits, which both banks claim are baseless. Some of the feeder funds if they are found guilty for the full amount Picard has sued for might not be able to pay.

Nonetheless, the December 11th, two-year anniversary of the Madoff fraud is likely to be greeted with more hope than anyone ever expected. Madoff investors might not get all of their money back, but they are likely to get far more than the pennies that was once predicted.

Related Topics: Bernie Madoff, Economy & Policy
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  • niapactnow

    I find it rather fascinating that the author can do a story about Madoff victims “breaking even” when over 500 lawsuits against victims of this fraud have been filed in the past few days alone. Nor does the story talk about the tens of thousands of investors who were invested in union pension plans, feeder funds, funds of funds and the like, who will likely not even see one penny. It is incredibly disturbing in this day and age to see such yellow journalism. In the words of the late great Senator from New York, Daniel Patrick Moynihan – you’re entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts. The facts are there for the finding. The reporter clearly did not want to find because if he had at least looked, he’d have found.

  • http://palmaire79.wordpress.com holeinone99

    This article does not represent the type of reporting we have come to expect from TIME.It conveys a completely false picture of what is happening to 99% of Madoff victims.The trustee is suing hundreds or thousands of small victims who have no assets to repay
    “other people’s money”That money has been spent for living expenses and to pay the IRS.I am a victim.The trustee is suing me for 100 times my liquid assets.What little cash I have will go to my attorney.This is a tragedy and this article is painting it as a windfall for Madoff victims.There should be an apology fromTime for this article.

  • tbtb

    Congress says they are looking into this Bernard Madoff scandal. Oh Great! The guy who made $50 Billion disappear is being investigated by the people who made $1.5 Trillion disappear! Read more about Madoff (http://amzn.to/hVOYW8) …

  • http://cx145.wordpress.com cthreatt

    “Bernie Madoff investors might end up getting more of their money back then they thought

    ‘then’ they thought? Are you serious?

  • http://wwpop.wordpress.com wwpop

    Mr. Gangel.
    You have presented false information that was MOST PROBABLY given to you by Irving Picard and his bosses at SIPC.

    Picard is only allowing 2,355 claims. He has denied 13,054 claims – 2,755 direct investors and 10,299 indirect.

    He has FALLACIOUSLY changed the the mandated statute of SIPC and the definition of “net equity” WHICH WILL ENABLE HIM to fill his pockets and THOSE of SIPC AT THE EXPENSE OF THE VICTIMS THAT SIPC IS SUPPOSED TO PROTECT.

  • http://cblmlc.wordpress.com cblgjcmlc

    ARE YOU KIDDING ME?????
    This is totally irresponsible journalism!!

    Why not tell the WHOLE story? There are investors out there who were living off their Madoff investments for years. Innocent investors with absolutely NO idea that this was a fraud. They were making 8-12% returns while others were making 30-50% but were happy because they believed that what Madoff was doing was less risky…the more risk the greater return.

    Well, those people, and there are thousands of them, are getting ZERO back as Picard decided to base their eligibility for SIPC funds on cash in/cash out. No time value of money. The money would have been better invested under the mattress! The courts will decide whether or not Picard’s definition is correct. I am not going to argue that.

    Not only are these people (1000-2000) getting ZERO, they are being asked to RETURN money. Most of them don’t have it! They were living off the money…get it?!?!?!?

    How irresponsible of you to say that Madoff victims will be made whole…make a profit???? Are you kidding me??? And the indirect investor who didn’t even know they were invested with Madoff? They get ZERO too!!!!

    How one sided can a story be??? I don’t have enough room here to rant even more.

    Cancel my subscription to the Times….ooops already had to do that when I lost all my money.

  • niapactnow

    How would your readers feel if they knew that their federally mandated IRA withdrawals were subject to claw back? Or, how about if your readers knew that their investment statements were worthless? That is what is happening with the Madoff fraud. The Trustee has publicly stated on multiple occasions that he is “clawing back” from innocent investors to pay back other investors who never took any money out. To do this, he claims, he needs $5 billion. Well, he has actions pending against those who were getting exorbitant returns as well as larger financial institutions such as HSBC, UBS, and JP Morgan Chase, totalling $50 billion. Why then the need to file suits against hundreds of innocent investors – many of whom are elderly and sick? What will he do with the extra money? Put it back into the SIPC coffers, perhaps? One of the villains of this crime? It might also interest your readers to know that the Trustee recoups –personally on top of the fees to manage this process — 3% of all recoveries – quite an incentive to move forward with innocent investors, dontcha think?

  • http://madoffvictimscoalition.wordpress.com madoffvictimscoalition

    It’s obvious to me that Mr. Gandel did not do his homework before writing his December 7th article, “Will Madoff Investors Break Even?”. The article is full of incorrect facts and needs to be fixed. The truth of the matter is SIPC protection is the ultimate fraud. Picard has denied SIPC protection to almost 85% of victims that have filed claims. SIPC, which self-admittedly never had enough money to cover the Madoff claims, is now getting the needed revenue ironically on the backs of the innocent victims that Picard has selected to clawback in order to replenish SIPC funds and pay the private law firm of B & H and the Trustee.

    Innocent people are being asked to return money that they rightfully withdrew from their own accounts over the course of a 6 year period innocently believing it to be their own, based on the reports that the SEC found Madoff to be a legitimate broker. Now those people who trusted the US Government’s sanctioned firm (Madoff) are being asked to act as the insurance company in lieu of SIPC for other victims. Picard is recalling money from the victims in order to pay other victims-precisely the job SIPC was created to perform. More importantly, this money clawed back will also find its way back to SIPC and ultimately into the hands of the trustee and his colleagues who have benefited to the tune of $20 million to date. It’s been reported that the total legal fees the trustee will receive may exceed $500M.

    Let’s look at the facts: Based on his own figures, Picard needs $ 5 billion to make the victims he deems worthy of SIPC protection whole. According to madofftrustee.com site, as of Jan 2010 he has already recovered $1.5 billion. He is suing UBS for $2 billion and Picower for $2 billion. He is also suing J.P Morgan Chase for $6.4 billion. He has settled on more than $1 billion since Gandel’s article was written. Based on the suits filed by Picard and the monies already collected, there is no need to clawback anyone else (innocent ‘small investors’) in order to pay back the victims that he deems worthy of SIPC payment. ANY MONEY HE COLLECTS FROM THE LIQUIDATION THAT IS NOT PAID TO VICTIMS GOES BACK TO REIMBURSE SIPC FOR PICARD’S LEGAL FEES (AT A CURRENT RATE OF $2M/WEEK) AND THEN THE CREDITORS ARE PAID. THUS, THE MORE HE CAN DENY THE CLAIMS OF THE VICTIMS, THE GREATER THE CHANCE TO FILL THE COFFERS OF SIPC. This, from the trustee assigned to “protect” innocent investors. Unfortunately, he and his colleagues stand to gain at the expense of the victims.

    I’d be happy to discuss this further and look forward to sharing additional information with you.

    Thank you,

    Ronnie Sue Ambrosino
    Coordinator
    Madoff Victims Coalition

  • http://liverpoollass.wordpress.com liverpoollass

    Mr. Gandell,
    You should be ashamed of yourself. This Is not fair and responsible reporting,the code of good journalism? Sir, you have fallen short of your responsibility to the public.Mr. Picard is going after banks and wealthy people. However, he continues to go after the elderly,widowed, sick and newly poor. How is it possible to wear two hats? The kind benevolent Robin Hood and the greedy, callous Robbing Hood. He is, as the word describes, Insensitive, Indifferent and unsympathetic. However, no were in the article do you discuss Mr. Picard’s renumeration. In many ways he is just like the man he is chasing only he does it under the mantle of the law. His interpretation of the law. We are living in sad times. All Americans should be aware this CAN happen to you.

  • http://bmvictim.wordpress.com bmvictim

    ATTENTION ALL INVESTORS

    AN URGENT MESSAGE FROM THE DIRECT AND INDIRECT INNOCENT MADOFF INVESTORS

    Did you know that your money is not protected by SIPC insurance?

    IF YOU INVEST IN A SIPC PROTECTED FUND THAT IS FRAUDULENT THIS IS WHAT COULD HAPPEN TO YOU…

    In recent days, Mr. Picard has masqueraded as Robin Hood seeking to redistribute assets to investors “deemed” worthy.

    What does this actually mean?

    • Of the approximately 13,000 claims submitted only 2000 have been approved for SIPC funds plus redistribution of recovered assets. 85% of claims have been DENIED. NO DISTRIBUTION OF FUNDS. In fact, he is suing the victims.
    • Pickard has billed out 85 million in legal fees and the cost rises daily. He expects to bill out in excess of $250 million in fees.
    Yet he leaves victims stranded without insurance which he has unilaterally denied
    unless a person is completely without any resources….a so-called
    “hardship.”
    • Picard told congress and the media that he would not come
    after “grandma” but that is exactly what he is doing. He has filed
    hundreds of lawsuits this week alone…many against elderly people in their 80′s and 90′s.

    Did you know that in the event of Fraud…..

    • THE VALUE OF YOUR ACCOUNT ONLY EQUALS THE AMOUNT OF MONEY YOU DEPOSITED
    REGARDLESS OF YOUR STATEMENTS TO THE CONTRARY.
    IF YOU WITHDREW MONEY THEN THAT IS DEDUCTED FROM THE TOTAL.

    • ALL INDIRECT INVESTORS CLAIMS HAVE BEEN DENIED. If you invest through
    feeder funds you are not even considered a “customer” by Mr. Pickard
    and his legal firm.

    • ANYONE THAT HAD AN IRA AND MADE WITHDRAWALS IS SUBJECT TO CLAWBACK.

    • LONG TERM INVESTORS ARE SUBJECT TO CLAWBACKS IF THEY USED THEIR MONEY
    FOR LIVING EXPENSES AND TAXES.

    • THE TRUSTEE IS NOW CLAWING BACK WHATEVER REMAINING ASSESTS A PERSON
    HAS POST THEIR MADOFF LOSS.
    He is asking for interest on the clawback.
    He is asking that investors turn over their tax refunds for net operating loss to him
    He is asking that fees for doing so be paid by the victim.
    He is clawing back from the estates of the deceased and the elderly.
    He has defined “hardship” cases as those that do not have any remaining assets.

  • http://liverpoollass.wordpress.com liverpoollass

    How low can Mr.Picard go. He recently clawed back a 70year old grandma fighting breast cancer. Way to go Irving, What a guy. By the way do you have a mother?

  • oldbbabe

    Mr Gandel,
    This is the worst piece of trash that has been written about the Madoff scam. Can you site your sources for all of the misinformation that fills this article? Whoever fed you these lies must have an agenda to which you fell victim. I hope that Time magazine will look into this horrible article and find someone who really knows the facts of this case and can write intelligently about it.

  • waltwriston

    HSBC is getting sued for 9 billion. By a trustee.

  • waltwriston

    Now that I think of it if the guy was as smart as he apparently though he was. He would took the money and run; I mean with the stock market dropping of a cliff and people are actually seeing their so-called investment falling all over TV. What did he expect? People are going to want to withdraw and get out early! Madoff should made-off with their money as soon as the market dropped!

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